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Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Here is one, Jackie and I were unsure of when we were down in Jamaica.
We pretty much tipped everyone we would tip here in America. Cab drivers, Bartenders, Food servers, Baggage handlers etc... I usually leave a 20% tip here on a bill in the USA. If the service is great I will leave more. If the service is terrible, I will generally leave 15%.
I understand that many people visit from Europe and Canada, and tipping etiquette may not be the same.
So what is the standard in Jamaica? Or do the people there, come to expect one thing from one group of people and something from someone else?
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
you are a generous tipper. surprised you would leave 15% for terrible service.???
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
original spanky
you are a generous tipper. surprised you would leave 15% for terrible service.???
Absolutely. 15% I worked my way through college in the service industry. In the states you make like 3 bucks an hour and depend on the tips to survive. If I have a bad day at my office job, I still get paid the same as I would on a great day. So that's kind of how I look at it.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
After 9 trips in the 3 years since I returned I've averaged 28.6% on food, drink, transportation, housekeeping etc.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
i tip like at home - the only difference is i make sure it goes directly into the hand that i want to have it - no just leaving it on the table . . .
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
captaind
After 9 trips in the 3 years since I returned I've averaged 28.6% on food, drink, transportation, housekeeping etc.
I love how you have it down to the tenth of the percent!!!
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
One thing I make sure that I take care of housekeeping staff. Waiters and barmen get their due but housekeeping get forgotten sometimes.hh
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
This is a good topic. I always tip at restaurants like I do at home, and make sure I take care of any hotel staff that has provided any service for us. I also tip taxi drivers a couple bucks at each drop-off. I've heard drivers complain that some tourists negotiate a price and then don't tip on top of that.
However, I am still a little confused about places that charge a "Service Charge" (i.e. Ivan's). I have heard that the Service Charge is a tip and that you are welcome add to it if the service is good. I've also read on some websites that the Service Charge is not considered a tip, and you are expected to tip a full 15-20% on top of that. What's the right answer?
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
I don't tip on top of negotiated rates on Taxis, it's not like they're running a meter in the states.
I too get confused at the service charges, especially those added on top of room rates. The owners state not to tip since that money goes into a pool for all the employees, but it seems like everyone expects something extra.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
"Tip all ya can afford, they need it........Smile more then you can afford, you need it"
:)
Have a SAFE Weekend
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
Flipadelphia26
Absolutely. 15% I worked my way through college in the service industry. In the states you make like 3 bucks an hour and depend on the tips to survive. If I have a bad day at my office job, I still get paid the same as I would on a great day. So that's kind of how I look at it.
I still work in the service industry(not restaurants anymore but I used to work for them) and no one I knows expects 20% for average service.
I'm sorry, but the wage creep expectations has gotten ridiculous.
It used to be 10%, now it fluctuates for average service to 15-20%, and in theory I agree that as cost of living goes up the wages should go up to, but the thing is they're going up at twice the rate they should be going up! If the food costs go up the wages will automatically go up to reflect inflation.
I tip 0% for terrible service when I know the server screwed up big time.
15% average service, stressed out server, overworked kitchen, etc.
20%+ above and beyond what I expect when dining out.
A good server that makes a crucial mistake knows when he doesn't deserve a tip, but at the same time I would never stiff any servers without a helluva good reason.
I'm laid back when it comes to screw ups and while I was in the restaurant business I learned that people do stiff servers for performing average service, but being realistic 20% for average service is uncalled for.
A good server still makes money, the bad ones quickly either improve or get the heck out of the business.
That said, I always tip for coat check(not that I'll need it in Jamaica....) and I usually always drop a $5-20 bill at the host stand because I used to run a host stand and 9/10 times the hostesses/Maitre D gets walked all over by customers, servers, management, etc and I've seen way too much under-appreciation for the craft of seating optimization.
If you can get me seated in a timely manner when your restaurant is fully booked and I see the hustle then I'm likely to tip the server and the host staff and maybe throw a $10 bill directly to the bussers/food runners.
That said, I can carry my own darn bags and no I don't believe in paying a service charge and then paying more unless they go above and beyond.
Speaking of tipping etiquette in Jamaica, does anyone have any success with the credit card sandwich trick at checkin? Is it frowned upon in Jamaica to tip the hotel desk for "upgrades"? I've used it in Vegas to some degree of success and am curious about the results in Jamaica...
The Sandwich trick is where you put a $5-50 bill between your credit card and ID at check in and hand it over to the clerk to "grease the palms" in order to possibly get upgrades/complementary items. If the clerks can't take it they'll usually give you the money back and life goes on, or at worst you're out the amount you "betted" on upgrades.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
Mike_D
However, I am still a little confused about places that charge a "Service Charge" (i.e. Ivan's). I have heard that the Service Charge is a tip and that you are welcome add to it if the service is good. I've also read on some websites that the Service Charge is not considered a tip, and you are expected to tip a full 15-20% on top of that. What's the right answer?
Mike...below is a link to an earlier thread about service charge/tipping...it should help clear things up.
http://negril.com/forum/showthread.p...ice-charge-tip
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
Bnewb
Interesting to read about the service charge, makes me not a fan of them because it creates inconsistencies in pay among servers depending on how many overall employees there are.
I get that restaurants need revenue, need to pay their employees, and have overhead; but at the end of the day the margins they have on food/drinks should reflect all of the overhead.
The final bill should be transparent instead of leaving room for interpretation on how much "extra" we need to leave to pay the employees.
There's stimulating the economy by eating out(good) and then there's paying too much for a given service.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
Blake
Interesting to read about the service charge, makes me not a fan of them because it creates inconsistencies in pay among servers depending on how many overall employees there are.
I get that restaurants need revenue, need to pay their employees, and have overhead; but at the end of the day the margins they have on food/drinks should reflect all of the overhead.
The final bill should be transparent instead of leaving room for interpretation on how much "extra" we need to leave to pay the employees.
There's stimulating the economy by eating out(good) and then there's paying too much for a given service.
From what I understand that charge on the ticket is Govt. taxes and a fee the kitchen staff negotiated in to law as they are not up front in contact with customers like the servers. Most Americans seeing it will think it is like an automotic tip that we add here in the states and NOT tip the poor server who has waited on them so well. Also I NEVER tip on a credit card. In private conversations with servers I am well assured that the NEVER see that money. I give them their tip in CASH , and as Seveen said, I always put it IN THE HAND THAT FED ME.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
I'd bet my last dime most kitchen staff never get all of their collected fees either.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Misti1...Rob explains the service charge in the thread that I posted.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
I appreciate the feedback everyone.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Anything on the check I don't count as a tip.
I always put cash in hand.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
dont forget the cook...many times we have asked to meet the cook...and while a handshake is given, slip a likkle something in his palm..when you return make sure he knows your back....I will bet you, your food wont be the same...lol or the amount....
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
Rambo
dont forget the cook...many times we have asked to meet the cook...and while a handshake is given, slip a likkle something in his palm..when you return make sure he knows your back....I will bet you, your food wont be the same...lol or the amount....
Mas Rambo...could be a she......
Miss Izel cooked for us for 11 years....more love from the woman cook I believe
Jamaican man cook good...Jamaican woman cook with love...if she love you that is......
But tip same way!
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
Bnewb
Thanks! That certainly cleared things up for me.
I think my initial confusion started when my wife and I ate at the 100 Candles at Ivans. This was the ONLY time during that trip that I used a credit card, strictly because the bill was well over $100 and also because I trusted the staff at Catcha. When I got the credit card slip back to sign, I noticed that there was no spot to add a tip. I did see that the Service Charge was added in but there no placed for me to add a tip on credit card (I didn't have enough cash on me for a tip either). When I asked the server if I could give a tip on my credit card she seemed a little surprised and said that they would have to run the tip through on a separate transaction. No big deal for me - I just had to sign 2 slips. However, I thought the reason there was no space on the CC slip to add a tip was because the restaurant considered the Service Charge to be the tip.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
Misti1
they are not up front in contact with customers like the servers.
Unless I'm missing something this is irrelevant.
In the US:
Servers are paid a minimal amount by the restaurant+the majority via tipping
bussers//foodrunners are paid hourly by the restaurant+a portion of the tipout by the server.
bartenders are paid a minimal amount by the restaurant+tips from the bar and a tipout by the server.
Hostesses, cooks, managers are all paid hourly or salary by the restaurant.
Unless Jamaica is drastically different in how the restaurant pays the employees, people shouldn't feel obligated to tip the chef separately, the restaurants should be paying reasonable wages to their staff, unless you're saying that in Jamaica they don't, which then makes me wonder where the restaurants get off charging the same amount as US restaurants AND also add a service charge.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
Blake
Unless I'm missing something this is irrelevant.
Unless Jamaica is drastically different in how the restaurant pays the employees, people shouldn't feel obligated to tip the chef separately, the restaurants should be paying reasonable wages to their staff, unless you're saying that in Jamaica they don't, which then makes me wonder where the restaurants get off charging the same amount as US restaurants AND also add a service charge.
Things are different!
Most on salary are making less than a babysitter in the States.
"I don't think we're in Kansas anymore Toto"
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
captaind
Things are different!
Most on salary are making less than a babysitter in the States.
"I don't think we're in Kansas anymore Toto"
That doesn't put it in perspective, babysitters in the States can actually make a pretty decent amount! :p
At the end of the day what exactly is the meal paying for in Jamaica if it's so different?
If the prices were a fraction of the price of a US meal your argument about employee pay being so low might hold water.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
Blake
That doesn't put it in perspective, babysitters in the States can actually make a pretty decent amount! :p
At the end of the day what exactly is the meal paying for in Jamaica if it's so different?
If the prices were a fraction of the price of a US meal your argument about employee pay being so low might hold water.
After 40 years in Jamaica with a home and two adopted children it's possible that I have a different perspective.
Your perspective is appropriate for you.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
captaind
After 40 years in Jamaica with a home and two adopted children it's possible that I have a different perspective.
Your perspective is appropriate for you.
How is my perspective different from yours? What is your perspective? That people should be charged twice for service?
Do you really believe restaurants shouldn't pay their employees fairly and charge accordingly?
I run three businesses in the US and we take care of our employees, a lot of business owners don't in the states and their sales inevitably suffer.
Turning to the government to mandate customers pay the employees properly is a cop out for a business owner.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Flipadelphia26
Here is one, Jackie and I were unsure of when we were down in Jamaica.
We pretty much tipped everyone we would tip here in America. Cab drivers, Bartenders, Food servers, Baggage handlers etc... I usually leave a 20% tip here on a bill in the USA. If the service is great I will leave more. If the service is terrible, I will generally leave 15%.
I understand that many people visit from Europe and Canada, and tipping etiquette may not be the same.
I'm Canadian and our tipping practices are the same as yours. I do vary my tip for the quality of service however.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Every other year, I am fortunate enough to be able to make a trip to the paradise that is Negril. We work hard and save to go, so when we get there we can enjoy ourselves and not fret about 500J here or there. I tip in the States and I tip in Jamaica. If my tips make someone's (read: cook, bartender, server, gardener etc) day a little better or a little easier...fabulous! After all, I am able to leave my country to visit theirs while many there are working to make ends meet. If you don't want to tip, don't. If you don't want to go to places with service charges, don't. It's your choice. There are LOADS of things I don't like, yet have to pay for, in the States. But pay for it, I do. This just seems like something silly to dispute. It's the way it is in Jamaica. If it bothered me that much, I'd probably go somewhere else. But, that's just me.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
Blake
How is my perspective different from yours? What is your perspective? That people should be charged twice for service?
Do you really believe restaurants shouldn't pay their employees fairly and charge accordingly?
I run three businesses in the US and we take care of our employees, a lot of business owners don't in the states and their sales inevitably suffer.
Turning to the government to mandate customers pay the employees properly is a cop out for a business owner.
At 70 I've reached the point where dollars aren't that important. I feel blessed to be able to do what I can.
My perspective is "Lord let me help where I can and not try to change that which I cannot... and the wisdom to know the difference"
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Help where you can and stop over analyzing a situation you cant change. Only factor you have control over is that "extra" tip. which isnt an extra tip but pepole are very close minded and dont look at it from the other side of the fence. so... I agree that this is a pointless point to be debating. It was done for the beautiful pepole of Jamaica the place you all love to visit you spend thousands getting there and staying there but a tip is the kicker...lol I'm just a youngin' and I get it. I don't understand the entitlement some pepole feel they have in a DIFFERENT COUNTRY. lol. ahhh to be ignorant must be bliss........BTW Im not directing this at any one person at all nor am I trying to argue with grown adults that should already have learned the FACTs of life by now... SO to sum this up no matter if theres a service charge or not if you like the "face" (the pepole you see) service,:p tip that person what you can... They will apreciate it ...unless you say something insulting when you give it to them like" you need this more than me" or something horrid like that... One pepole. One love. and everything IS going to be alright so relax man. Just enjoy your vacations... whats the point of worring on a vacation... you might as well have stayed home
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
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Originally Posted by
Beebeluv
Help where you can and stop over analyzing a situation you cant change.
If I was sitting there on vacation I'd agree to stop analyzing it, I analyze most situations to come to the best conclusion I can, it's silly to stop questioning why things are around, otherwise it just leads to a bad outcome.
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Originally Posted by
Beebeluv
Only factor you have control over is that "extra" tip. which isnt an extra tip but pepole are very close minded and dont look at it from the other side of the fence.
How am I supposed to look at it from the other side of the fence if we're not allowed to analyze it? Or better yet how are we supposed to look at it from the other side when the other side just says to chill and says it's the way it is.
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Originally Posted by
Beebeluv
I agree that this is a pointless point to be debating.
Pointless to you maybe, but to many of us that want to understand why things are the way they are and to actually make things better then it's far from pointless.
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Originally Posted by
Beebeluv
It was done for the beautiful pepole of Jamaica the place you all love to visit you spend thousands getting there and staying there but a tip is the kicker
That's a weak argument, there are beautiful people everywhere, that doesn't mean you nickle and dime tourists visiting you after they've already spent thousands getting and staying there.
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Originally Posted by
Beebeluv
the entitlement some pepole feel they have in a DIFFERENT COUNTRY.
It's not entitlement to want to know why things are set up the way they are, it's not entitlement to want to know whether the people working there actually get the money from a service charge, and it's definitely not entitlement to want to pay the right amount without overspending.
It IS entitlement to expect tourists to shell out simply because they are spending their money already.
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Originally Posted by
Beebeluv
SO to sum this up no matter if theres a service charge or not if you like the "face" (the pepole you see) service,:p tip that person what you can...
I'll tip based on the service received, and I will factor in a service charge given that it IS double dipping not triple dipping if you're charging me for the food(which includes overhead/salaries)+ a service charge(paying for staff)+a Tip(paying for staff again).
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Originally Posted by
Beebeluv
unless you say something insulting when you give it to them like" you need this more than me" or something horrid like that
There is a difference between questioning the status quo and insulting the workers. Believe it or not I have worked and do work in the service industry, that doesn't mean I'm "entitled" to make a certain amount.
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Originally Posted by
Beebeluv
whats the point of worring on a vacation... you might as well have stayed home
Who said I worry on a vacation? There is a difference between posting on internet forums and debating the merits of things like service charges, and being ON vacation.
I do as the Romans do while in Rome, that doesn't mean I don't want to know as much as possible about the culture and where MY money IS going and where it IS NOT going.
I learn as much about businesses as I can but I'm not going to sit in a store and start blasting a business owner on how he should operate(unless he's paying me a consulting fee).
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Blake,
Since you do want to learn as much as you can about business in Jamaica, there is a good article written by a tax attorney in the Observer and published about a year ago - here is the link:
http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/busin...erence_9461924
A couple key points are 1) yes, it is somewhat redundant for a restaurant to charge the service fee when they could have simply raised the menu prices by the same factor and 2) it is NOT a tip, it is a service charge, not a "good service charge". You pay it just the same way as if the item cost that much more.
There is no "double dipping" - the restaurant is liable to pay the same taxes on the service charge as they do on the food costs, as it is simply an addition to the food cost. There are no taxes paid by the restaurant on any tip you would leave, that is a different thing all together - a tip is not "paying the staff" but a personal reward that you give the server for their prompt service.
So your "food equation" should actually read "food + service charge (which includes overhead/salaries and paying the staff) + a Tip (rewarding your server for good service).
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Again I say it. Itemized on not Itemized. It is no different than anything else in business. For those that are curious as what to do in Negril. It's simple, do as you would at home and all will be IRIE. As stated, the vast majority make next to nothing every week and the extra dough they make on tips is very much appreciated.
Blake, you are passionate about this topic as you continue to seek understanding. Are you aware of the so called Italian price?
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Another thing to consider about the service charge when it is shared among the employees is that in a tourism economy like Negril, when things are busy, the employees earn more money. Rather than just receiving their hourly rate, they get a bonus based on the service charge. So when the business makes more money, each employee would make more money as well.
This is an easy and fair way for more people to directly benefit from the tourism in Jamaica.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
If the bill says gratuity added I consider that when figuring the tip. If it says service charge I tip as I normally would and I too tip 15% for service 20% for good service and more as warranted for exceptional service. For driving charters whether airport or excursion I tip the same. I round up in route taxis because it's quick and easy. For house keeping I leave $5US a day and make a point to get to know our house keepers and add a little more on the last day. I tip bellmen and baggage handlers $1US per bag minimum. And I always make it a point to get to know the security guys and put a little in their hand as well. It's always worked for me. Bless...
Ed
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob
There is no "double dipping" - the restaurant is liable to pay the same taxes on the service charge as they do on the food costs, as it is simply an addition to the food cost. There are no taxes paid by the restaurant on any tip you would leave, that is a different thing all together - a tip is not "paying the staff" but a personal reward that you give the server for their prompt service.
So your "food equation" should actually read "food + service charge (which includes overhead/salaries and paying the staff) + a Tip (rewarding your server for good service).
Thanks
Per your article I would argue that they are in fact double dipping.
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Thus, a service charge applied at a restaurant is somewhat redundant as the restaurant business is a service industry, just like a law business. Imagine your lawyer sending you a bill for legal fees and then adding a 10 per cent service charge.
My biggest issue is where the service charge actually goes and why it exists, not that it benefits the people of Jamaica.
1. If it goes towards the employees, then logic dictates the food prices would reflect that, yet Jamaican restaurants seem to be on par with US restaurants.
2. If it doesn't go towards the employees(which some employees claim, see one of Rob's first posts) then where does it go?
3. If the food prices don't reflect the employees pay(excluding servers, I'm not debating the merits of gratuity), then what DO they reflect?
This has nothing to do with how poor the country is or the desire for us to support the Jamaican people, enforced capitalism isn't a free market, the restaurants should pay their employees better and price their food accordingly.
I support the people of Jamaica when I visit either directly(gratuity) or indirectly,but this makes me wonder if the restaurants are supporting Jamaicans.
Let me try to make it clear that while I'm opposed to the tipping system(in that it does NOT increase the quality of service), I understand why the tipping system is set up. I can't fathom the service charge as being anything other than a double dip if the food costs are meant to reflect employee pay(excluding servers).
At what point is it excessive? I believe in transparent pricing and not a low ball on the food and then a bunch of extra service charges.
I'd also like to point out that the GCT is applied TO the service charge, which means you're not just paying an extra 10%, you're paying 10% extra+GCT even though the food prices are not lowered to reflect that.
I do believe that they should change the name from service charge to service tax to avoid confusion about whether or not it's considered gratuity.
At the end of the day I'm far from cheap, but I am frugal and like to know where my money is going and why it's being taken the way it is.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
OKAY, I'll bite! Booger, please elaborate on "Italian Price?"
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Blake,
It seems that you are not understanding the concept that the service charge IS part of the cost of the meal. To call it a tax would be incredibly dishonest and is also against the law. It is NOT a tax or some strange/double dipping additional charge - it could have been added DIRECTLY into the item cost. But to add it into the food cost would not help the employees take home pay when times are busy. This simple procedure allows the employees to have a bit higher take home pay when times are good. In order to help the employees receive a little more benefit from the tourism industry, the service charge is calculated as a separate item. As pointed out, this allows all the employees to receive a bit more money than just their hourly wages when times are busy. Think of the shared service charge as a bonus to their hourly wages.
As I mentioned in the other Service Charge thread that was posted earlier, "It is often speculated that the employees never see the service charge. You may even hear that from the employees themselves. But this is simply not true. If a business has a service charge, then the business can be fined and even closed should they do not share this with all their hourly employees. A server may say they never see the money, but they do see their percentage of that charge which is of course much smaller depending on the number of employees. For the example above, the server may feel they didnt get anything from it, because they never saw 90% of the charge. But they did receive their percentage on their paycheck." Simply put, not every employee is privy to how the restaurant's accounting operates, nor is it in their immediate interest to let you know the exact details.
You ask why the food prices are on par with the US prices. That is because Jamaica is a small developing island nation and needs to import the vast majority of what is served. Take into account that fuel prices are way more expensive in Jamaica (gas is about us$6 a gallon, what did you pay this weekend?) and electric charges are higher than the US, and imported items are higher in cost than in the US, and it is easily understandable why the costs are what they are on the menu. You are not in the USA but Jamaica, so you have to readjust your thinking to take into account the differences between a major world power with vast natural resources and a small developing island nation.
Many restaurants choose to not have a service charge and raise their menu prices to reflect this. If the government dis-allowed service charges tomorrow, the menu item costs would go up at places that have a service charge. You would pay the same either way. But at present, for places that do have a service charge, this simple accounting breakdown allows the employees to directly benefit from tourism when times are busy. And of course you will pay GCT on the food bill - both the menu item cost AND the service charge (if applicable) are the cost of the meal.
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob
Blake,
It seems that you are not understanding the concept that the service charge IS part of the cost of the meal.
Except that a service charge is added AFTER the meal, it is NOT part of the meal unless you consider gratuity part of the meal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob
To call it a tax would be incredibly dishonest and is also against the law. It is NOT a tax or some strange/double dipping additional charge - it could have been added DIRECTLY into the item cost.
It's no more dishonest than saying it's part of the meal, at this point I think we need to break down what the food price goes towards:
1. Rent
2. Food costs
3. Employee overhead
4. Utilities, bills, etc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob
But to add it into the food cost would not help the employees take home pay when times are busy.
Why wouldn't it help the employees take home pay? Are you saying that the restaurants would withhold it and pocket the money? Why are we playing games of transparency when it comes to the cost of running a business?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob
This simple procedure allows the employees to have a bit higher take home pay when times are good. In order to help the employees receive a little more benefit from the tourism industry, the service charge is calculated as a separate item. As pointed out, this allows all the employees to receive a bit more money than just their hourly wages when times are busy. Think of the shared service charge as a bonus to their hourly wages.
Can we call it what it is, a tourism tax? I don't necessarily see anything wrong with it, what I have issues with is the sugar coating that goes into it.
I'm all for paying the employees fairly and especially when times are busy; but the meals should be transparent and the restaurant owners should be the ones to shell out and the prices should reflect it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob
As I mentioned in the other Service Charge thread that was posted earlier, "It is often speculated that the employees never see the service charge. You may even hear that from the employees themselves. But this is simply not true. If a business has a service charge, then the business can be fined and even closed should they do not share this with all their hourly employees. A server may say they never see the money, but they do see their percentage of that charge which is of course much smaller depending on the number of employees. For the example above, the server may feel they didnt get anything from it, because they never saw 90% of the charge. But they did receive their percentage on their paycheck." Simply put, not every employee is privy to how the restaurant's accounting operates, nor is it in their immediate interest to let you know the exact details.
So are we in agreement that the servers need to be honest and say that they do see a portion of it?
Why was the manager lying to the other person about what the service charge is for?
It's in their immediate interest to be honest with the customers instead of lying through their teeth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob
You ask why the food prices are on par with the US prices. That is because Jamaica is a small developing island nation and needs to import the vast majority of what is served. Take into account that fuel prices are way more expensive in Jamaica (gas is about us$6 a gallon, what did you pay this weekend?) and electric charges are higher than the US, and imported items are higher in cost than in the US
I understand that Jamaica is a small developing island and needs to import the majority of items. That said if it isn't sustainable then perhaps they need to reevaluate the business model, countries(the US included) need to try to not rely on imports to sustain the entire nation.
Fuel prices here are $4-5 a gallon, electricity is extremely expensive(Over $1,000 a month for each of my stores in utilities), rent is Ridiculous(up to $200 a square foot), regulations cost a lot to comply with, and shipping can kill our profit margin.
We also tend to have higher employee costs(I start my people at $10-$20 an hour), imported items are still prohibitively expensive, and we tend to have a LOT of taxes.
If you want to say that food prices in Jamaica are the same yet don't include labor(given that this is what the service charge is for) I have a hard time believing that the food costs reflect purely import costs(especially for the places using local seafood) alone.
All of what you described every US business deals with on a daily basis, yet we don't have service charges.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob
You are not in the USA but Jamaica, so you have to readjust your thinking to take into account the differences between a major world power with vast natural resources and a small developing island nation.
I will adjust my thinking when I'm actually in Jamaica, currently I AM in the USA. That doesn't mean I can't question why there is a service charge above and beyond the cost of the food+gratuity.
Transparency is key if you want to build good will, the service charge should be part of the food and if you want to keep gratuity go ahead(even though it doesn't foster better service).
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rob
Many restaurants choose to not have a service charge and raise their menu prices to reflect this. If the government dis-allowed service charges tomorrow, the menu item costs would go up at places that have a service charge. You would pay the same either way. But at present, for places that do have a service charge, this simple accounting breakdown allows the employees to directly benefit from tourism when times are busy. And of course you will pay GCT on the food bill - both the menu item cost AND the service charge (if applicable) are the cost of the meal.
I would prefer that there be no service charges and allow the restaurants to compete on an even foot.
I'm of the opinion that a service charge does Jamaicans a disservice because when foreigners sit down they're not going to have this entire forum's worth of perspective, most people will see a service charge and assume(right or wrong) that it IS the gratuity, especially on meals that are more expensive.
When you Mandate a fee to pay the employees it isn't optional and it doesn't foster good will, it leaves a bad taste in a lot of people's mouths, especially when the managers don't even know how to explain the service charge!
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Re: Tipping etiquette and Jamaica.
i somewhat admire your persistance with this AND somewhat annoyed, but ROB HAS IT COVERED btw thank YOU ROB for all you do and I am looking forward to meeting you in NOV. ...lighter note why are u aruguing with a man that is currently located in alcholics annonamous lol jk jk lol
btw ur obviously not in "aa" well maybe but thats not our buisness... but which state do you live in this might help us clarify ur utter annoyance with this situatiuon
