Tfw that's funny about wall mart......I hate that place.It is pact and the tills are slow.grrr I would rather pay more then to shop there.Quote:
Originally Posted by tfw73
Printable View
Tfw that's funny about wall mart......I hate that place.It is pact and the tills are slow.grrr I would rather pay more then to shop there.Quote:
Originally Posted by tfw73
I'm also noticing that this thread is getting heated. I enjoy giving my money to the locals..you get better service,they remember you..and its nice to see them smile when you give a little to much :o
I didn't think my last post would be that offensive. I thought I was actually conciliatory on most points and especially compared to my earlier posts where I DID slam the JA gov't on bureacracy and corruption. In the last post I was just trying to fill in the holes of generalizations in my earlier posts and personalize it with details of my actual experience. And use that to argue just my position that charging duty INSIDE the country (as opposed to airport tourist duty) was harmful instead of helpful. It's a political argument but I didn't think it was offensive - even now going back re-reading that last post - I thought it was mild. I am confused why you seem so offended by it.
I think sending pics to people who were in them is normal activity both here and in JA - my fiance and her friends take dozens of pics when I am there and share them with each other. I see all kinds of pics on their FB walls, and many other JA FB friends. My point about saying normal in the US in that sentence was that mailing an SD chip was normal way to share pics in US and something noone even thinks twice about. Not a commentary on what's normal in JA. I offered it only as explanation of why I didn't think twice it would be any problem in mailing them to JA.
The same with calling it a sour experience and relating the prices. As I said, I was completely ignorant of JA Post Office duty before that. I didn't think relating my experience and calling it a sour experience - because it was completely unexpected - would cause offense. It was late 2010 when I got those SD chips in USA - shortly before the 5-week trip listed in my signature. Soon after I know they were triple that price when I was in Negril because I priced them at several places because my then-GF wanted copies. The SD chips that go in electronic frames are the same SD chips that go in cameras and computers. It's not that they were rare or new in JA - they had them all over and I had bought them there in prior trip - they were just very expensive. I'll just make a guess it's your explanation that maybe the JA gov't no longer considers them luxury goods - so prices are same now? You seem to imply I am making it up about the price difference - why would I when it would be simple to ask a merchant who sells them what they cost 15months ago or so.
I didn't say the JA gov't was ripping off it's people because of difference in certain activity - but difference in price gov't artificially inflates and makes their own people pay. I was relying on your info that higher price is due to duty on what JA gov't deems luxury goods - like TVs. And if someone charges inflated prices - don't we all commonly refer to that as a rip-off. Tourists would rarely have a reason to buy a TV, mainly JA people do. But I don't think it matters whether it is luxury goods or everyday goods - TVs or SD-chips or suntan lotion or bug spray or batteries or other things I have seen with inflated prices - having a policy that artificially inflates prices hurts sales and therefore hurts the economy and therefore the JA people. I know that is debatable opinion because is economics. So that paragraph might be controversial - but I don't think it was personal, just political.
Regarding having to mail the gov't for the duty schedule. I didn't just criticize them for that - I also said they did a good job with online visa info. I only asked why if they could do one - why not the other. Most places I have seen where info is in both printed form and online - even the JA visa info - they tell you to rely on the online info because printed info that gets distributed is almost impossible to ensure it is current. You only have to update one form electronically vs having to print and distribute new paper forms and collect out-of-date ones.
You asked why I don't bring just a checked bag, and buy the liquid goods there. I brought it up because I think it reinforces my reasoning of why I think the JA internal duty (as opposed to airport duty) hurts the JA economy and so the JA people. If you can so easily, and completely within the tourist duty rules, bring in goods like suntan lotion, bug spray, shampoo, lotion, batteries, etc that are half the cost in US vs JA - it's only human nature to do it. Maybe it's only me, but I don't think so - I see alot of people posting questions about what things like this cost in JA. And at least to me, it has nothing to do with brand names - I couldn't care less. I don't begrudge anyone for whom price isn't a concern - I don't know why you begrudge me for whom it is a concern. I would hope JA gov't would realize this and change their policy so it wouldn't be an issue to anyone.
Finally, why would you think I was planning to sneak a big-screen down there? I don't even think it's possible to fit a 30" TV in a suitcase. Is that where the source of the the animosity comes from - because I argued it's insane to have a duty law that depends "it's not what's in your bag if you have to pay duty, it's what's in your head" - and you apparently agree with that law? When I started asking questions about my own situation, I asked if anyone knew what the airport tourist duty would be - or what the other section of the duty laws that applied to people moving household goods down would be - so I could compare the US price plus baggage fee plus duty to the JA retail price. Later I even said that I came around to the advice given here to buy in JA, and don't get a flat screen and maybe to buy used - and asked for prices on gently used or new but 2010-or-so model. Hardly the questions/posts someone thinking about sneaking a TV in writes. I couldn't care less about brand name - just value - so if they have competitively priced goods, I'll buy them. But whenever I go shopping with my fiance - whether for household goods, clothes, kids toys, construction materials, and especially electronics - I am shocked at how much more expensive most things are there. Almost everything except JA food to cook at home. I wish they had more of local mfg base and more locally produced items. But I don't see that happening nor the JA economy improving much without huge change in their gov't - bureacracy, corruption, size, bank lending policies - and yes, one more time, tax/duty policy. But my criticism is not unique to JA policies - I think pretty much the same about US policies, too - just a likkle more so about JA.
I do like a lively debate, and think I try hard to stay civil doing it. I did discuss my own personal business because I thought it added to discussion - but I tried not to get personal about others business. If I fell short in that, and offended - I apologize. Sometimes it's hard to be passionate about a topic, and not be somewhat confrontational.
Dispensing accurate and helpful tourist information is purpose of this board and why it was created. The original poster's question was best answered by Sweetness in that there is no reason to bring down a tv for someone when you can get it here. There is never any reason to lie to the customs agents of any country to which you are entering. That is not sound advice.
To elaborate on the additional tourist related comments, you can purchase items such as shampoos, bug sprays, sunscreens, etc. on the island when you get here to make your air travel less of a burden. On the way from the airport, just stop in at MegaMart and you can find a wide variety of products you need at affordable prices. You can wait til you get to Negril and go to HiLo or Valuemaster to make these purchases, but the selection will be less and the prices slightly higher on some items.
Local brands and Caricom produced brands are the least expensive and are comparable in price to the North American brands that most of our visitors are familiar. North American brands tend to be more expensive.
So to save the hassle of carrying these items with you, you can purchase them on the island in an affordable fashion.
OB,
The fact that you are married to a Jamaican and building a house in Jamaica makes your situation different from tourists visiting the island. I understand that you are having problems understanding how and why the Jamaican government makes the decisions that they do, but I do feel that you need to take more time to understand the differences in the USA economy and the economy of the vastly smaller developing nation of Jamaica.
Perhaps its not relevant to compare prices in the US to prices in JA, hey, I didn't like the cost of things in England compared to the US when I went there... its based on their internal economy. The US has enormous land and people resources, thus many things cost less in the US, as profits are generated by selling many units of a thing.
As a future long-termer/resident, just compare prices within Jamaica, and you can do all right. It pays to look around and shop around, even in Negril. Prices vary from store to store and some will negotiate. Shopping can be more personal/in-person here.
I totally agree with you, Lola.
As a Canadian that lived near the American border...we would venture over to the US for certain products that were always much cheaper than buying in Canada. In one instance a friend of mine wanted to purchase a car radio that in the US would cost $100us. In Canada the item would cost around $400us...by the time we bought the item, paid for gas, paid a huge amount of duty...this product came out around a total of $300us...still much cheaper than we could have bought it for in Canada. I still see some items that are much cheaper in the US than Canada....but this is extremely logical as Lola & Rob have pointed out...the economies are different for each country.
OB...I've been reading what both you & Rob have written & if you think you've offended and/or you're debating Rob...I don't think you're getting the gist of his message. If you're truly planning on living down here....there's certain aspects of your preconceived thinking that you will have to let go and this is what Rob is trying to suggest to you....otherwise, quite bluntly...you won't make it & it'll cost you more in the long run.
As someone who has been living down here for 5 years full time now...Rob (and now I) have these questions asked quite often. We find by the way someone responds to the received info, predicts whether they will survive down here or not. I've heard Rob being called negative, anti-American, pessimistic and a buzz-killer :) when asked how to survive in Jamaica...but the reality is he has survived here successfully, full time for 20 some odd years...this has been no accident.
I've heard & seen many people trying to purchase property, build homes here, start businesses all without success...and it breaks my heart as I know this is a dream for so many people. My wish is that they would listen to someone that has actually made it here & why they have. It's sad when I hear the one's who don't make it, then blame either the Jamaican people or the government or both when the problem is obvious from the outset.
If anyone is trying to live down here and/or start a business...my simple advice is to talk with someone that has succeeded & is still living here successfully.
Soooo ummm, do they have gluten free items at Mega Mart????
You can get most everything at Mega Mart - here was a photo taken just before Christmas inside the store. I have seen many gluten free products on the shelves...
Attachment 11881
Wow! Looks like my kind of store. I'm trying to see how much stuff for Daniel I need to bring with as opposed to being able to get there.
Where exactly is the Mega Mart? Looks huge! I have heard so much about it but I never went there. Generally upon arrival, I get out of Mo'Bay pretty quickly. Either because I am on a Juta or my pickup wants to get away from the traffic. I have driven on the island - Negril to Mandeville was a good run - but never in Mo'Bay. That is a concern I will have to overcome & just do it.
http://tickers.TickerFactory.com/ezt...63c0/event.png
SweetSue looks like we arriving the same day!
Yup! Maybe I'll see you there on the beach...Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta
http://tickers.TickerFactory.com/ezt...63c0/event.png
Oh no! My husband and I are addicted to bulk shopping!!! I hope we can resist spending all of our vacation money at Megamart!Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob
Hi all - back finally. I got a detached retina requiring eye surgery and not allowed to read or use computer - but finally allowed to again. They inject a bubble in your eye to help hold the retina in place, but that means no flying for 6 weeks minimum. Also, first 5 days off work had to use my PTO that WAS going to use for vacation days in JA. Bottom line - JA trip off until probably Sept or so, when I earn another week's PTO. Oh well - that's life.
Bnewb, Rob, Sweetness, and others - I DO thank you for the perspective, truly. I'm glad my posts weren't being taken as offensive. I thought they were - and being replied to with criticism for my being cost-conscious - but reading other's takes on comments, must be just me. My frustration came from having several customs questions (long-term move related section of customs laws, not the vacationing tourist related) and not finding answers. No problem - everyting criss, mon!
So this is in the same spirit of just providing information. To those boardies who ARE cost conscious, almost to the point of being obsessive-compulsive (like me) - or those thinking about longer-term living, not a short vacation - the following is offered as my experience so far, unique as my situation is.
Just as background as to where I am coming from, all my life I have value-shopped - it's just my nature now. I grew up on a crop and dairy farm in Ohio - having to work hard to earn things starting with chores before/after school as early as I can remember. I paid my own way thru college (Mechanical Engineering) by using savings and co-op'ing. I subscribe to Consumer Reports to learn how to haggle better with salesmen and know what items are rated the best value. I read and listen on the radio to Clark Howard (the Consumer Warrior - "Save more, spend less, and avoid being ripped off") and Dave Ramsey ("how to get debt-free"). I setup web alerts to track airfares for several weeks before each trip. I even check 2 1-way airfares compared to Round-trip airfares. So for me, it's almost impossible to NOT compare prices and value, it's just second nature.
So all that are the reasons I have been so obsessed with comparing US-to-JA prices (and you're right, I'd probably be better off if I didn't). But the biggest is that like probably most of you preparing for vacation, I go shopping before every trip - usually several times. And the prices get ingrained because I am comparing between K-Mart, WalMart, Target, Sams Club, etc before I finally buy (maybe that's not as usual). So when I see the same items in JA the next week for so much more - it just blows my mind. And it does make me worry about plans to live there, albeit part-time. That's something I'll just have to work on.
Now, I DO realize that living there longer term, that would fade (hopefully) - and I would just get used to JA prices and comparing between THEIR stores. But even then, I will be retired doing snow-bird thing married to a Jamaican - 6 or so hot months in USA, 6 or so cold months in JA. Not living there full time and running a business like many of you where you forget the prices back home. So I will still have the "curse" of knowing what items could be bought for back in USA.
So being in the more unique position I am currently - planning marriage to a Jamaican and slowly building/stocking up a house there from A-Z over many vacations, and planning on living there half-time sometime down the the road - this is my experience so far. From batteries, to bath and kitchen items, to towels and bed linens, and especially small electronics, and everything in between - a cost-conscious to the point of almost being obsessive/compulsive shopper definitely notices the price differences. And I have to disagree and say it's not minimal - I've saved hundreds of dollars by bringing many of these things down. (NOTE: nothing remotely close to TVs - just things that few-weeks staying tourists bring all the time - especially those that are house renters). What I know I can't bring down I DO buy, or plan to buy, in JA - but it hurts knowing the price difference. I wish I were like many of you and COULD just get it out of my head. Granted - my experience is just stores in Negril to Sav areas (my fiance has lived in just Westmoreland and St. Elizabeth parishes - MoBay is not familiar to her, and so not to me either). So it sounds like we need to add a shopping day or two to MegaMart, ATL, and other places in MoBay, each trip.
Now you may think - well how does this guy enjoy spending money vacationing in Negril, then, if he's that cheap? I have just been talking about comparing prices and hating to pay MORE THAN NECESSARY - it's not that I don't mind spending. Jamaica is a great value for vacationing, comparitively (I'm learning that for living - just not so much). But if you've seen me and my now-fiance out and about on previous trips, you know I frequently bring her family/friends along on our excursions and days/nights out. Last St Patty's Day Pub Crawl was good example. And I bring down lots of OSU Buckeye clothing to give away - to friends new and old, her family, hotel staff - and especially for all their kids. (but I do buy it at the Dollar store - LOL)
Hey Buckeye - sent you a message. I still believe almost everything needed to live in JA can be bought in JA and most are similar pricing to US especially in Sav or other non-tourist areas. Over the years I have brought household goods w/me for long trips only to find them right at Hi Lo for cheaper than I paid in US. Dollar store and stuff like that are good for kid stuff so there are some exceptions but really most things I had to buy to set myself up household wise (and I like all the comforts tru mi) were affordable. Difference I noticed was the name of the brands but quality seemed similar too to what I have at home. I do like my special sharp kitchen knife, microfiber blanket and some fancy candles, stuff like that that I bring but the basics are right there and not higher in most cases. Just my experience. Plus often in JA prices can be negotiated - not the case in the States--gotta watch for sales.
I hope your eye heals up quick so you can get back down. Prayers for you and yours. Sweet
OB,
Sounds like our backgrounds growing up in Ohio had many similarities. I had a lawn/snow business with a friend starting at the age of 12. I also worked hard for my money. I paid for my own car. I paid for my college. I also subscribed to Consumer Reports and read it religiously. I knew where all the outlet malls were located in Ohio and shopped at many of them. Heck, my girlfriend is from bargain shopping capital of Canada! But I think you are missing my point about how important it is to support the local economy of the country in which you are choosing to live.
Earlier you have made some harsh judgments about how the store, Courts as well as the Jamaican government are ripping off their own customers/citizens. You suggest that the customs duty should be avoided by being less than truthful to the customs agents when coming to the island. You make these claims and yet now state that neither you or your fiance are familiar with Montego Bay, which has more consumer choices than Negril and Sav La Mar combined. I would hazard to guess that you are not familiar with the least expensive shopping area on the island either, Kingston, which has more choices than Negril, Sav and MoBay combined.
I am not sure how you can possibly come to these conclusions when you are admittedly unaware as to what items are actually available on the island, or how cheaply they can be purchased. Some of the outlet malls I mentioned earlier were the same distance from Columbus as Kingston is to Negril. As it was for me then, for some items, the time/hassle/cost associated with getting there is worth the savings.
You are choosing to and suggesting for others to not support the local economy of Jamaica, a small developing island nation where you are building a home and are wanting to live half your future years. You say you want Jamaicans to have it easier and have more consumer choices. I do as well. But, in order for the necessary changes to take place, the local economy needs to grow. For you to choose to not support the local economy and to suggest for others to do the same is contrary to this goal. Rather than being a part of the solution, you are choosing to be a part of the problem.
This has nothing at all to do with the cost of products in the US. It does not have to do with being cost-conscious or being an obsessive/compulsive shopper, although if you are as obsessive as you claim, you should really be familiar with shopping in Montego Bay and Kingston.
The point I have been trying to make is that it is all about helping the local economy of the place you are choosing to build a home to grow and prosper.
And please dont think for one second that those of us who live here are not aware of the prices of items in our birth countries. I am not even sure why you would suggest that. Besides, there is this handy thing called the internet that lets you see prices from stores all over the world...
Rob - I have been reading your comments on this subject and it has definitely affected what I do or do not bring down. Sure, I still throw in a few items that I would not have opportunity to find or buy on the island. Small gifts or certain toiletries I prefer. Those 3 jars of peanut butter I got for half price, ha ha. A really cute item for someone's new baby. Otherwise, I just bring a little more cash and I am trying to find the best places to shop in JA. I understand what OB is saying about Courts - I feel the same way about the places in NY that capitalize on the inability of the poor to save money or get credit. They end up paying 3 or more times as much the true cost of the item. It is not only in JA that the poor get taken advantage of. Plus, I am not totally pleased with the quality or price of certain items I have looked to buy in JA but I definitely understand the need to support the economy - if only because I care about people who live there.
Thanks for all you do as a source of solid information & reason.
Peace.
http://tickers.TickerFactory.com/ezt...72b9/event.png
Very informative thread. This is making me consider what items I plan to bring with me next time I come. Last time I came I packed mosquito repellant, sunblock, toothpaste, etc. But this is making me consider staying in MoBay long enough to purchase these items. Question - I have sensitive skin and need serious sunblock that doesn't have a bunch of dye and perfume. I usually buy neutrogena or something comparable for sunblock. Are brands like that available at MegaMart?
Been through similar (though I was not expecting to be paid for the items) but I did not expect to have to pay duty. Some customs agents are reasonable but some are trying to squeeze $$ out of travelers and others are just plain NASTY!
I would not be worried about paying duty on mosquito repellent or sun screen. Unless you are carrying an unreasonable amount of it.
It's ALIVE again- some topics just won't die. LOL.
If you do bring down items that you might have to pay duty on - i.e. baby clothes for a JA friend, and you are not traveling with a baby; school supplies to donate; and the like - I suggest you bring the receipts. If they do impose duty, at least you will have proof of the true value of what the item cost you to purchase. Otherwise, similar to what TBfan mentioned, they could set the duty based on the much higher cost of what the items would cost in JA.
My experience has been (with mailed items, not had it happen at the airport) that the duty is NOT a small percent of the value of the item - it was 100% of THEIR assessed value of the item. I don't remember exact values any more, but just for example. SD cards I bought in US for, say $10 - used to mail vacation pictures to my fiance - that cost $30 in Negril - they initially wanted $30 duty. After a few days of my fiancee arguing with them at the post office, they agreed to a lesser amount. So as TBfan mentioned - seems like it depends on what agent you get, and there is no amount set in stone. If I had known there was going to be a duty assessed - I would have included the receipts for the SD chip in my mailed package.
I am not worried about paying duty on sunscreen/bug spray. Rather I was thinking that it would be better to support the local economy and purchase there. But - I need to know if I can buy US brands there because I desperately need my sunblock and I have very sensitive skin.
this one got rob going! hehe.. dont mess with the BOSS lol hehe