An important notice for those staying "off the beaten track"...

I have recently been getting some emails about renting of "guest houses" and some hotels all around the island. Not all places to stay are the same.

A recent tragedy was in the paper the past few weeks and the hostel property was not a JTB licensed and insured establishment.

Here are a couple links to keep you up to date with the latest in the JTB/licensing issues:

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/article/l...ting-illegally

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/article/l...ak-death-story

Unfortunately this is no joke - that is why we are so careful that businesses promoted on Negril.com are legal businesses.

Please take your time researching the place you stay.

Rob

Ya'll listen to the man!

Cap

true dat mon !

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Originally Posted by captaind & Linston

Ya'll listen to the man!

Cap

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ditto

The post is a bit confusing. As stated in the 2nd link above, the facility where the 2-yr old died HAS been registered with JTB / TPDCo since 1965 and registration IS current. The police superintendent called it a 'death by misadventure' [MISADVEN'TURE, noun Mischance; misfortune; ill luck; an unlucky accident.] It is not one of the many unlicensed or never-licensed businesses that have abounded on the island for decades. However, it was really off the beaten track!

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Originally Posted by Lola

The post is a bit confusing. As stated in the 2nd link above, the facility where the 2-yr old died HAS been registered with JTB / TPDCo since 1965 and registration IS current. The police superintendent called it a 'death by misadventure' [MISADVEN'TURE, noun Mischance; misfortune; ill luck; an unlucky accident.] It is not one of the many unlicensed or never-licensed businesses that have abounded on the island for decades. However, it was really off the beaten track!

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Quote from the second article.

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The tragic freak accident was caused by a branch blown from a tree about 50 feet away, which has withstood a lifetime of hurricanes without any incidents. The branch fell on to the tree under which the family was camping. This resulted in the loss of a little boy's life, which is extremely distressing to us all. Our heartfelt sympathy is with his family.

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We had something similar happen here in park with someone walking on a path below. Branch feel and killed them. Total freak accident.

Dear Rob, Cap & L, Irie A, Smitty, Lola, Hille141,

Much Respect to you all for your comments on the thread Re: "An important notice for those staying "off the beaten track"...

Stuff happens in life, call it fate, destiny, bad luck, the way it goes, etc....... As we all know the press in many instances can be mistaken, misquoted, misleading, or dis trustful, many different reasons and causes.

I agree with Lola that the "post is a bit confusing"

John Allgrove and his family have been owners and managers of Whitfield Hall for at least 50 years. Highly respected by most everybody that knows him or the property itself come away from them with respect and appreciation for them. 99.9% of all who have hiked to Blue Mountain Peak either stay or pass directly by Whitfield Hall as it is the start / finish line for the hike to the peak. I personally have on two different occasions hiked the peak and have recommended to other Negril.com "boardies" how awesome the hike to the peak, mountain, the summit, and experience are.

Not having any additional information other than the two links provided Rob, my understanding is that a branch from an old tree fell (known sometimes as a widow maker) fell, struck another tree and ended up landing on a tent below killing a two year old boy.

"The tragic freak accident was caused by a branch blown from a tree about 50 feet away, which has withstood a lifetime of hurricanes without any incidents. The branch fell on to the tree under which the family was camping. This resulted in the loss of a little boy's life, which is extremely distressing to us all. Our heartfelt sympathy is with his family ".

Lola and hille141 are exactly right "Total freak accident".How would have "Unfortunately this is no joke - that is why we are so careful that businesses promoted on Negril.com are legal businesses". changed anything.

I thought for a minute and remember an incident at Rick's Cafe in which a young Canadian man died after jumping from the cliffs. Rob your post on that particular thread said.


"This link has already been posted in another thread.

I am moving this post into that thread... "

All I can add is Rest in Peace to the young boy Can Sarioglu and condolences to his family along with the Allgrove Family as well.

Sincerely,

Johng

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Originally Posted by Lola

The post is a bit confusing. As stated in the 2nd link above, the facility where the 2-yr old died HAS been registered with JTB / TPDCo since 1965 and registration IS current. The police superintendent called it a 'death by misadventure' [MISADVEN'TURE, noun Mischance; misfortune; ill luck; an unlucky accident.] It is not one of the many unlicensed or never-licensed businesses that have abounded on the island for decades. However, it was really off the beaten track!

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Lola,

The property, at the time, was not JTB certified and licensed. The Gleaner fact checkers would not have missed such an obvious error as that. Here is a quote from the first article, please note the final paragraph:

"Where Whitfield Hall is concerned Hickey said records show that TPDCo has been writing to the operators for the past 16 years.

“I have a file dating back from 2000 where these people at different stages have been told to meet the requirements,” said Hickey.

“I see where they had gone in 2013 and got insurance, so it would seem to me that they are trying to get licensed. But you really should not operate contrary to the JTB Act if you don’t have it (a license).”

But proprietor of the property, John Allgrove has criticised TPDCo for constantly changing the requirements to get licensed.

“The TPDCo people will not accept the application form unless everything is in place and I don’t have control over all the things that are supposed to be in place,” argued Allgrove.

“The parish council people are supposed to do some, the fire brigade are supposed to do some, the police liaison people supposed to do something and then the health people supposed to give my people food handlers permits. To line up all of them at the same time has become an impossible issue,” added Allgrove.

The Sunday Gleaner was unable to ascertain if the tragedy that took place on the property last Saturday could have been avoided if all the requirements had been met."

In the second "article" which was a "letter to the editor" from the property. They were licensed by the JTB from 1965 to 1995, then TDPCo since 1996. In 2001 and since then, the certification changes as stricter requirements are made. One of the latest changes is that all properties must have security camera surveillance. The property in question had problems meeting these changing requirements since 2001 - they speak of it themselves. Here is a quote from their response. Once again read the final paragraph. They have admitted finally meeting all requirements, which will allow the license to be granted once inspected:

"4. From 1996 to 2000, we were able to easily satisfy the TPDCO requirements, but around 2001, they added some requirements, which included approval and certification of our security arrangements by the Police Liaison Office, which took several years to come.

5. Most of the inspecting/certifying organisations do not have four-wheel-drive vehicles, so we generally have to provide transportation from Hagley Gap or Mavis Bank.

6. The JTB will not issue a licence unless ALL requirements have been met at the time of the application and, given the various requirements from different organisations with start and finish dates, it has proven very difficult to achieve this. However, our licence fees are paid up in full until 2017.

7. We have now satisfied the requirements of all the agencies involved in the TPDCo licence process and conform thereto. Further, TPDCo conducts an annual inspection of the property."

Please note, just because you have paid the JTB, does not mean the license is issued. Only after the the TDPCo inspection will the license be granted.

But what difference would being licensed have made in the outcome? I'm honestly curious. Insurance?

Hard call to make. Tree limbs that are in the direct vicinity of where the guest are residing in their tents obviously should be regularly inspected and cleared to avoid this type of thing. In this case the tree limb that failed was 50' feet away but it sounds like it caused a domino effect bringing down the fatal limb that killed the youngster. Was it apparent that the weak limb could fall and cause other limbs to come crashing down? It is hard to tell unless we were there to see how things were positioned.

In any case, my heart goes out to the family of this poor little guy. I go camping every now and then and this event will have me thinking carefully about where to place my tent from now on.

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Originally Posted by johng

Lola and hille141 are exactly right "Total freak accident".How would have "Unfortunately this is no joke - that is why we are so careful that businesses promoted on Negril.com are legal businesses". changed anything.

I thought for a minute and remember an incident at Rick's Cafe in which a young Canadian man died after jumping from the cliffs. Rob your post on that particular thread said.


"This link has already been posted in another thread.

I am moving this post into that thread... "

All I can add is Rest in Peace to the young boy Can Sarioglu and condolences to his family along with the Allgrove Family as well.

Sincerely,

Johng

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Johng,

As the Gleaner asserted, they are unsure if the regulations would have prevented this freak accident. But that doesnt change the fact that staying at a JTB approved, licensed property provides a measure of safety and legal advantages that non-JTB places do not. This is no joke. To treat it as such is a disservice to all.

As for my moving the second thread on the same topic to the existing thread about the "young Canadian man" who died at Rick's, the family and friends did not want multiple threads about the tragedy to be posted. We respected the wishes of the family and friends, who we know personally. This was a personal issue for us as well.

It's good to know that said inspection encompasses inspection of all tree limbs on site.

The tree limb was an "act of God" that could not have been foreseen......

The diver and his friends at Rick's was a candidate for the Darwin Award. A true "charlie-foxtrot"

None of that changes the fact that the tourist business is highly regulated.

Adhering to regulation especially in Jmaiaca (the US is not far behind) is a full time occupation.

As a visitor it's best you stay at an approved place. It won't help with acts of God or stupidity but at least you'll have a lawsuit to file

The days of staying at Miss Mary's or Miss Ruby's are gone. Things change

Cap

Rob,
I am not treating this as a joke, those are not my words, I didn't start this thread but only commented which I thought was the point.

Cap, you and I and many other Negril.com boardies have seen many "Acts of God" and "Stupidity" over the years in Negril (which was at one time "Off the beaten path") as well as the rest of the island. I myself admit to jumping off the cliffs at Rick's back in the 70's. Looking back it was a really stupid and dangerous thing to have done and I am lucky that "The Great Lord was looking after me".

The image and "Reality" of Negril has changed many times since Miss Mary, Miss Ruby, Miss Gloria, Mr. Fred, Mr. Peat, etc... Things change everywhere and stuff happens that many times are simply out of our control.

Positive Vibrations,

Johng

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I think it is important to emphasis the words in the thread heading "off the beaten track"

Yes, I guess Miss Mary's and Miss Ruby's is sort of "off the beaten track" when talking about Negril but the place where the newspaper was referring to is WAY off the beaten track. Pictures of Negril in the "old days" does little to describe a place like Whitfield Hall or may other rural places where tourists infrequently venture.

In fact, if you had to stay at a JTB sanctioned place around where I live in Accompong Town you would probably end up sleeping in your car because there are only a scant few.

I don't know how many people here have ventured up to Mavis Bank, Whitfield Hall or Blue Mountain Peak but I would bet it is only a handful at best. Rural Jamaica is not necessarily the type of place that most travelers that visit this board want to stay but only go out on Day Trips to enjoy.

If I never would have started out visiting rural Jamaica and instead started by staying at Sandals then perhaps I would never have gotten so comfortable out on the island living in a Jamaican community. I had my share of misfortunes over the years having been robbed and pick-pocketed but never felt in danger staying at "off the beaten track" type of places but it is not for everyone. On that, I think we all can agree.

If you want to play it safer, stay in places where they are inspected, licensed and sanctioned so you at least have some legal recourse if something happens. I think this board is a valuable resource for casual travelers to Jamaica and that is the choir we are all preaching to. Always know your own limitations.

Peace and Guidance