Another July .....

I returned a couple of weeks ago from another wonderful trip to Negril. I lost count but its close to 15 different visits. Obviously, I'm a big fan and love everything about it. I always stay local, non-AI at Coral Seas Garden and it is a wonderful place -- great location, nice room, pool, people! I get out at night and always visit Bourbon Beach, Roots, Alfreds, and Jungle. I love to eat/drink at 3 Dives, Best of the West, Qualitys, Canoe, Sir D's, Chicken Lavish, Seastar, Sweet Spice, Sweet Spot, Drifters, Mama Flo's, Tony's Hut, Corner Bar, and a few others.

One HUGE disappointment was an early afternoon experience on the cliffs. After swimming at Seastar for a bit, we decided to ride my rented scooter around the corner to Out of Town Pastry for a patty or two. After exiting the lane, I was stopped by a police road block. I slowly pulled to the side and cut off my machine. Now, I am good friends with many Jamaican families and had a 22 year old young woman on the back of my scooter who wanted Coco bread. I didn't think anything of it. Well, I spent the next 45 minutes being harassed by 6 Jamaican officers. Where is your license, your scooter is out of registration, etc. They tried to intimidate me into paying off a fine right there but I just ignored them and waited patiently. I rented --like I always do - from JahB's. I handed them the paperwork from under my seat and said call him. His nephew rode up the cliffs and attempted to sort it out. I took his scooter back down to the beach -- forget the patty trip and just head to the beautiful beach - wasted almost an hour! A couple of disappointing sidebars. On at least 8 different occasions, renegade motorcycles flew by going well over 50 mph. All they did was get out of the way-No attempt at all! Probably most disturbing was the looks, vulgar comments, and harassment that the young lady with me had to endure. The language and flat out sexual descriptions that they bombarded her with was incredible. She ignored them and resisted their strong animal-like advances but it was ridiculous! Their continual comments were way out of line and obscene.

i have had a couple bad experiences with the local police. glad you stood up to them.

It’s great that you had a great time but unfortunate you came across the police roadblock….

these days they are trying to show a presence on the West End…..and around town
but their training in dealing with the public is evidently very lacking….especially with tourist
not very tourist friendly to piss off the tourist so easily and use vulgar comments….

I too have a problem with the police…the white man/white boy comments are unnecessary….
and you got to stand your ground with them or it will cost you money….
cops asking for money so dem can buy a beer should be a no no and it has to stop

if they are to continue these road blocks they need to have a police motorcycle or two with them….
it’s not productive without them as the motorcycle guys speed up and whiz right pass dem….
wi have a lot of motorcycle police riding around Negril these days….so they should be put in place…
mi see them motorcycle police go up and down mi lane at least four times a day now….

there was a somewhat of a crackdown on bikes when the Canadian was murdered by Kaisers…..
but there are still way too many speeding motorcycles flying down the roads these days….
mi have come close to getting clipped by these maniacs too many times to count……
mi have been told that a large portion of the bikes on the road in Negril aren’t even registered….ugh

just one of the many things that need correcting here……and so it goes…….

Cool Runnings, Marko

We got stopped in July as well. Our experience was fortunately different, they just made us put on our helmets and let us go.

I got stopped for a document check on the beach road on Saturday, The officer was polite and professional. My papers are in order so after a short friendly chat. I was on my way. No problem

Cap

Sorry to hear about your troubles, Beachballer. Maybe there was more to it than meets the eye. Not judging you AT ALL, but maybe something else was going on that you didn't or couldn't know about??

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Originally Posted by captaind

I got stopped for a document check on the beach road on Saturday, The officer was polite and professional. My papers are in order so after a short friendly chat. I was on my way. No problem

Cap

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Yup...same here.
I've been stopped many times in my 10+ years of living here (only mentioning the length of time to understand the possible number of stops) ...I've never had any issues...and in a couple of cases I appreciated the stop as they were looking out for me.

what about their advances was "animal-like"????

I am sure they were BLACK MEN,
but what made you described their actions as Animal like????

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Originally Posted by Bnewb

Sorry to hear about your troubles, Beachballer. Maybe there was more to it than meets the eye. Not judging you AT ALL, but maybe something else was going on that you didn't or couldn't know about??

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No worries...but absolutely nothing going on from my end, just a tourist going to buy a patty??

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Originally Posted by Markospoon

what about their advances was "animal-like"????

I am sure they were BLACK MEN,
but what made you described their actions as Animal like????

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Well.... would love to tell you exactly but not the place. Lets just say .... talking about her body, private areas, and what they want to do to her.

Shocked that they kept on when they had a female officer with them as well. Not right anywhere!

That sounds like a human being.
I never heard an animal talk that way or any way before.

My fault... you're right. A RUDE human being!! My momma raised me differently. I don't believe any woman should be walked up to and subject to those comments PERIOD.

I am curious, maybe just being a dumb Minnesotan, but I didn't see where beachballler referred to any black men. Are you saying he is referring to black men when he states "animal like"? Having experienced a lot of unwelcome behavior from men and women over the years I can assure you animal behavior has no color associated with it. After all people, all people, are capable of animal behavior.

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Originally Posted by Markospoon

what about their advances was "animal-like"????

I am sure they were BLACK MEN,
but what made you described their actions as Animal like????

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Markospoon

what about their advances was "animal-like"????

I am sure they were BLACK MEN,
but what made you described their actions as Animal like????

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didn't know Black Men and Animal like behavior go hand and hand.....
maybe mi missing sumthin as I don't see where the OP stated this.....dunno

well mi live among the Jamaicans for many years and was married to a Jamaican for many years...
and what wi think and what the Jamaicans think of what is socially acceptable sexual terminology are two different things sometimes..
and without much thinking when the Jamaican officers are in the presence of foreign travelers......
they have rattled off a lot of crude sexual profanity comments in mi presence (and asking for money to buy beers)....
again it comes down to the training which might be fine when dealing with Jamaicans at the road blocks/stops.....
but when dealing with tourist a lot more training is needed by these policeman in Negril........just an objective observation

now they have officers riding in unmarked cars and they are getting out and searching people as they walk down the West End Rd...
yesterday was the first time mi saw this by SamSara......when 4 officers exited a plan unmarked toyota....
and searched 2 young guys that were walking towards downtown.....
mi hope if this continues their language is appropriate especially in the presence of Jamaican or Foreign ladies..and/or guys....

Cool Runnings, Marko

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Originally Posted by Markospoon

What were YOU doing with her in the first place?
Maybe you are the animal.

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that's uncalled for .......PLEASE REMOVE THIS POST

Cool Runnings, Marko

First of all.... Irene....Dumb Minnesotan ?? speak for yourself !!! ( lol )
Beachballer take on this is pretty obvious, to me anyway.... Not saying it was your situation, but many older tourists men, get with the younger Jamaican ladies, same thing with the older tourist women..so on....
I'm pretty sure the cops just don't like it !!! ( My opinion )

Hi Irine,
I have not seen a White/Caucasian/person of European decent , Police Officer in Negril.

Maybe Marko has.????? I don't think so.

I haven't seen any in 20 some years, so.........

If they were White,........ still they are not animals.

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Originally Posted by jojo p

Not saying it was your situation, but many older tourists men, get with the younger Jamaican ladies, same thing with the older tourist women..so on....
I'm pretty sure the cops just don't like it !!! ( My opinion )

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it's not the age thingy here really ......as plenty of Jamaican police officers get with much younger Jamaican ladies........
it's the interracial thingy.......Jamaicans with North Americans or Europeans etc is what they don't like or jealous of...(my opinion)

Cool Runnings, Marko

Phew.......glad you didn't say Canadians.......;););)

Marko,
You are right,
It was uncalled for.
Sorry folks.
Racism has no place anywhere.

This thread demonstrates how emotionally charged some topics can be. They depend on what is posted, and how readers interpret the post based on their own point of view.

With racism being a main news story in the US, it is not surprising that it was mentioned in this thread.

The original poster did mention men using "animal like" (apology made) behavior when talking to the young woman on the back of his scooter. While never mentioned, another poster took this as a racist comment (apology made).

Racism has no place here and I don't think it was the OP's intention. Another poster has since blamed it on inter-racial relationships.

Once again, racism has no place here and I feel it played no part in the what transpired. Blaming what happened on race is not accurate.

Another poster seems to have realized the true cause of what happened, and that has to do with the age difference.

Prostitution, while being illegal is so much in demand by visitors, both male and female, that trying to enforce the laws is a losing battle. Of course this leads to police frustration.

When there is a substantial difference in age between older visitors (of any colour) and much younger Jamaicans, it can lead to obviously prejudged behavior by those who see it. It doesn't matter how innocent it may be, a large age difference influences people's view of the situation.

The OP mentioned that this happened on multiple different occasions, so the repeated viewing can lead to conclusions, right or wrong.

The only way to prevent this is not to hang out with locals who are substantially younger. We may give a ride to a friend who is older or close to our age, but we would be looking for problems by giving much younger people a ride

So ageism is ok? Police officers need to demonstrate a professional manner whether they are in uniform or not. Tourists and citizens should not have to tolerate this behavior based on an assumption. Nor should they change who they socialize with for the same reason. If prostitution has lead to police frustration, that is on them. Perhaps if they did some real police work,and got prostitution under control, they wouldn't have the time or inclination to harass innocent people.


Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere....Martin Luther king Jr

Welcome to the Board and Happy New Year! Interesting first post. Bringing up a 4 month old thread...

Not what I thought would be my first post of the new year, but here goes.

Ageism or exploitation? With all the media coverage of the "Me Too" movement in the US, there may be an age element but the underlying issue is with exploitation.

People who have power over another, be it job, money or influence related, can, have and do abuse this power. The victims in the "Me Too" movement for the most part had it done behind closed doors.

In Negril, this exploitation behavior is so prevalent that it is done out in the open. On New Year's Eve, we witnessed a much older visiting woman groping the butt of a substantially younger Jamaican man in public. Too much PDA to say the least.

Speculation can be made of all kinds, but let's look at a few simple facts. Jamaican minimum wage is roughly $50US a week. Ever leaving the island for a vacation is a pipe dream.

Visitors on the other hand have already bought a plane ticket. Obviously there is a very different financial situation between the average Jamaican and the average visitor.

What we witnessed may have been completely innocent, but when you see it many times a day happening with different people, not all of them can be innocent. Exploitation is taking place. And when you see it everyday of the year, even from a non police viewpoint, it can become frustrating.

Prostitution is considered illegal in most the civilized world because it is not a victimless crime. Prostitution is called the world's oldest profession and has been outlawed by different civilizations for around the last 10,000 years. But even the most Draconian of them never got it "under control". Expecting Jamaica to be the first civilized country in the modern world to do what has been impossible since civilization started is unrealistic.

The Negril Police do real police work. Police everywhere should be respectful of those that they protect and serve. But police happen to be human too.

In the US, "body cams" are being made mandatory for many cities and States because police (humans) can make mistakes. Being verbally disrespected when you are associating with substantially younger locals while on vacation can suck, but not as much as being shot or killed which unfortunately happens so often in the States that body cams have become necessary.

As I have said, which I will try to make more clear, the only way to prevent any person from assuming you are not exploiting a younger Jamaican is not to hang out with locals who are young enough to be your child or grand child.

I've been given the "eye" by some Jamaicans and visitors when traveling on the beach with the grand/great grand pickny.

Nothing I can do about that. Usually the Jamaicans figure it out pretty quick but some visitors have actually scolded me for being with young people.


So it goes

Cap

My wife and I befriended a Jamaican women several years ago while on vacation, or should I say we hung out with her as she was willing to teach us dominoes and talk about Jamaican culture. She was very interesting, but also very pretty. She was 20 years younger than us and walked 30 behind us on the beach when we went anywhere to avoid conflict and perhaps getting beaten. it saddened us deeply but we learned that we were not in the USA, or Canada, or a lot of other countries that wouldn't understand. We must respect who they are to visit them and be part of their culture. But keep in mind they also know the rules and the young lady knew the risk of being on that scooter that day.

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Originally Posted by Irine

Phew.......glad you didn't say Canadians.......;););)

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No - Canadians would still be there apologizing .... eh?