Does anyone have an idea about how many of the bars/restaurants/hotels are actually locally owned in Negril?
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Does anyone have an idea about how many of the bars/restaurants/hotels are actually locally owned in Negril?
Yes! This is gonna be interesting!
Hey Rob. My gf and I will be in next Tuesday for about a week. Be nice to say hey again. Not sure if you remember us, she is from Cleveland. We bumped in to you at Goa a couple of years ago and again at the Tree House in March I think. Hope all is well.
Yah man! See you soon! Our number is 876-423-5479
Great. I'll shoot you a message when we make it in.
Excellent!
We have two first time visitors coming along with us this time.
Best place to take them Jeff! Once ya go then ya know :)
That's a good question. I try to patronize the smaller establishments along the beach if possible, in the mindset that they are more apt to be locally owned. but I really don't know who owns what. One of my favorite spots (forget the name) for sunset Red Stripes is a little bar about half way on the beach that always has a little sandwich board advertising the price, last time I was there it was somewhere around J$150 . super cheap. Attachment 51639Quote:
Does anyone have an idea about how many of the bars/restaurants/hotels are actually locally owned in Negril?
Here is a start for you . I stay at the Golden Sunset and it is owned by Ray Arthurs. His brother Alfred owns Alfred's right across the road.
Sounds like Phineasfreakers may be talking about Sunnyside, right next to rooms on the beach. This is one of our favorite haunts.
What are you considering “local owned.” Owned by a Jamaican born, a “mom & pop” type place, or just not a huge corporation? When on the cliffs we often stay at Catcha, and the owners live right on the property.
Great question.
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Originally Posted by jeff brown
The definition of "locally owned" I think is up for debate. Someone had posted on FB they only support "locally owned" establishments. I wondered what that meant and what those were. I think people having varying opinions on what that means. I live in Louisville KY. Home of YUM Brands. I think they own KRF, Long John Silvers, etc, etc. So if I go to a LJS in Louisville is that a "locally owned" joint? :)
I don't know. I think everyone's mileage may vary. Happy Friday and SOON COME!
John...which owners are you referring? The owners of Catcha are foreign born and none of them live there that I know of.Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnNYC
Some of the properties off the top of my head that are owned by someone born in Jamaica include...
Hotels - Charela Inn, WhiteSands, Crystal Waters, Travelers, Coral Seas, Primrose, Rondel, Ansell's Thatch Hut, Firefly, Hidden Paradise, Fun Holiday, Idle Awhile, Mirage, Jah B's, Sandy Haven, Roots, Kuyaba, Lighthouse Inn, Rayon, The Caves, Sandals, Couples, Merrills.
Bars/Restaurants - I can't think of any bars or restaurants that aren't owned by a Jamaican other than the obvious chains or hotels with bars/restaurants.
The Caves: Pretty sure Chris Blackwell was born in England.
Pretty sure Bertram Saulter was born in Jamaica...Quote:
Originally Posted by Odinson
Eddie Seaga wasn't born there either. He became prime minister. He was a Jamaican citizen by birth.
So what is a "local"?
Cap
I always assumed the white haired gentleman and the thin blond woman (sorry, usually bad with names) who lived at the top of the property were the owners.
Cap,
In my opinion, a local is someone born in, or at least living in an area for N extended period of time.
Okay John, I know who you mean & no, they don't live there. One person is a manager and the other person is one of the owners that lives in the US...but comes & goes between the two countries.Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnNYC
To me a local in any country is someone born & raised in said country or someone that has chosen to reside in an area full time. It also helps to be part of the business enviroment, politics etc....
Here's one version of local:
"My leader born here" Michael Manley political video from the election of 1976
Watch it all the way through and see Toots. Jimmy Cliff etc before the dreadlocks days. A great picture of Jamaica in the '70s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kE_o3unHwvY
Cool! I assumed that since The Caves is part of Island Outpost, it was owned by CBlackwell. Maybe Island Outpost is just a holding company or some kind of other business jargon that I don't understand.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob
Probably too literal, but I would define a Jamaican as someone that holds (or is eligible for) a Jamaican passport.
Chris and Bertram developed the property...
Just an opinion or observation. Perhaps it's just the video they chose to shoot, but in this video and others I've seen from the 60's and 70's it would appear that the Jamaican economy is healthier in these clips then it is now. Is Jamaican economy better now? I really don't know. The infrastructure looks better in the older vids.
Quote:
Originally Posted by captaind
The infrastructure was pretty good while England was in charge of fixing it. Of course, all the riches they took from the slave labor was enormous so it was a small price to pay. When Jamaica wanted Independence, the English were happy to oblige and wash their hands of that expense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Irine
I had a quick look at Jamaica's place in the 2018 economic freedom rankings and some of the supporting data. They are definitely being abused by the international money lending community. As a 3rd world economy it's pretty disgusting to see the interest rates they have to pay and the long term effects it has on the country and it's people. Most of the Caribbean countries seem to be in a similar strangle hold. You would think foreign investment would be interested in strengthening their investors not bringing them to their knees. OK Ok I'll stop being a Debbie downer, and this isn't the right thread either. It' just that when I see the Jamaica of old compared to the Jamaica I visit every year it makes my heart ache. Locally owned is a small ray of sunshine.
Always a dangerous thing commenting on another country's economy with only "facts" and not familiar with the history of how they got there in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by Irine
No need to start an argument where there will be as many differing opinions as there are people. If being abused means having to get their fiscal house in order before anyone (including the IMF) would loan them any more money then I guess guilty as charged. Being an island with virtually no manufacturing or VAR business and an enormous trade imbalance with the US, trying to live beyond your means and borrowing more money to pay what you already owe is a recipe for disaster. The abuse is working and the price has been high but the Economy is getting better.]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irine
Irine, if you haven't seen it, I would recommend that you watch the documentary "Life and Debt".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_and_Debt
I will watch it for sure, thanks.
I guess Accompong I have a hard time understanding why the IMF charges the interest they do when they know it will cripple the country that has to make the payments. And it's not a Jamaica conversation alone, they loan money to many countries who struggle with repaying it. Definitely don't want to star an argument, not my nature, just an opinion shared.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rasta Animal
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irine
I didn't mean with you necessarily. Just that everyone has a different opinion on things. The IMF has to charge interest because it uses other people's money to make the "secured loans" (which they back) and the investors who put the money up are not in the give away business. If Jamaica had good credit, they could go elsewhere but they don't.
Also, thanks Rasta Animal for adding that important video. It is in my collection and watched quite a bit.
Think about this. If you were a private investor, would you want to invest in a country where it's currency wasn't properly stabilized? As soon as you convert your currency into Jamaican Dollars you are at the will of the market value. Look at Venezuela now where $1 US is worth $41290 Venezuelan Bolivars on the black market and virtually worthless and Jamaica owes them money for oil they supplied.
Crime will have to be stabilized before foreign investments will feel comfortable with risking their money on a large scale other than possibly hotels.
Peace and Guidance
While Life & Debt is an excellent historical documentary explaining how the old IMF and World Bank operations worked at the time and did leave Jamaica in worse shape than when it began, it needs to be put in its historical perspective. The opening narrative of Life & Debt is taken from "A Small Place", a 1988 novel. The world has undergone significant changes since then.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rasta Animal
Michael Manley was interviewed for the documentary and he died back in 1997. Released in April of 2001, the IMF has undergone restructuring with less "draconian" rules in 2005 and then again in 2011.
I am in no way defending the IMF, but facts being what they are, they have eased up a bit on their old dictatorial way of micro-managing the economy's of their loaner countries.
Since that movie was released Jamaica has gotten out of "partnership" with the IMF under one administration and then back into "partnership" with the IMF under the following administration. When the admin changed again, the government renegotiated the terms of the loans from the IMF, which was unthinkable back in 2001 when the movie was released.
The free trade zones mentioned prominently in the documentary have changed substantially as well since 2001, with the current free trade zone rules bearing little resemblance to the rules in effect 17 years ago.
In 1983 due to the IMF imposed "austerity budget" it was illegal to hold or spend any foreign exchange (US dollars, Cad, English pounds).
It made being in business impossible which precipitated my closing my two companies in Jamaica.
However, it was a heck of a black market for a while. It was the origin of the street money changers you still see.
Thankfully that kind of draconian regulation is no longer part of the standby IMF agreements
Cap