Some thoughts

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Originally Posted by TiCtOc

Yay brasi you are catching on to the rules of lurve!

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Live and die by the Tic Lurve Rules. The END.

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Originally Posted by utenlov

One of the things I did find quite amusing was the fact that my norwegian ways apparently differs a lot from many US and Canadians. The swimming for one thing. I was amazed how many people who just stood in the water, thigh high. We don't do that in Norway, we get in the water and out to the deep end. And then we hang around there. And if we decide to just stand in the water, we stand neck high in it. I don't mean there's anything wrong with keeping your bikinis dry, it's just an cultural observation.

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Some of your points are valid observations .... but, I'd say you're on a slippery slope making very 'broad, sweeping generalizations' about North Americans. I've seen a lot of people in the water ..... go neck-high, and go all the way under ...... and I'm having a hard time believing that they're all Norwegians. Good god .... as a North American, I've never 'just' stood in the water thigh-high, where I didn't get into the water ALL the way at some point. And every travelling partner I've ever brought with me to Jamaica from North America and South America has also gone in the water ALL the way. Matter of fact, of all the North Americans I know, less than a handful get just their legs wet (perhaps they never learned to swim?) ...... but most everyone I know tends to swim, dive, we get wet and go for it!!!! A lot of times it's not just neck-high - it's jumping off the cliff, or diving into the deep water from a boat. This is not a cultural difference unless you want to make it one (which borders another slippery slope of racism, unless you asked each of these North Americans why they were knee-high and ascertained that they indeed had the ability to swim). And peeing in the bushes ... this is not a cultural difference either .... It's going to come out one way or the other ..... if you waited too long, or were too indifferent to find a bathroom (they're all over in Negril) .... that's not Norwegian ... that's being human .... even North Americans will 'go' when the body says 'go'.

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Originally Posted by Kritter

Some of your points are valid observations .... but, I'd say you're on a slippery slope making very 'broad, sweeping generalizations' about North Americans. I've seen a lot of people in the water ..... go neck-high, and go all the way under ...... and I'm having a hard time believing that they're all Norwegians. Good god .... as a North American, I've never 'just' stood in the water thigh-high, where I didn't get into the water ALL the way at some point. And every travelling partner I've ever brought with me to Jamaica from North America and South America has also gone in the water ALL the way. Matter of fact, of all the North Americans I know, less than a handful get just their legs wet (perhaps they never learned to swim?) ...... but most everyone I know tends to swim, dive, we get wet and go for it!!!! A lot of times it's not just neck-high - it's jumping off the cliff, or diving into the deep water from a boat. This is not a cultural difference unless you want to make it one (which borders another slippery slope of racism, unless you asked each of these North Americans why they were knee-high and ascertained that they indeed had the ability to swim). And peeing in the bushes ... this is not a cultural difference either .... It's going to come out one way or the other ..... if you waited too long, or were too indifferent to find a bathroom (they're all over in Negril) .... that's not Norwegian ... that's being human .... even North Americans will 'go' when the body says 'go'.

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Thank you for saying this! I swim, dive, and have been known to use the facility when it's been an emergency!

I'm sorry if I made a broad, sweeping generalization. I thought I made it clear that I did not mean everyone, but many. It's not like I was out in the deep end alone all the time. Most of the time, yes. I have not been all over neither beach nor cliff, and my observations are stated solely on what part of beach I saw. As for the peeing, I don't belive that is a solely norwegian thing, what I wrote was based on the comments I got from locals. English is not my native tounge and sometimes it comes off different than I intended

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Originally Posted by utenlov

I'm sorry if I made a broad, sweeping generalization. I thought I made it clear that I did not mean everyone, but many. It's not like I was out in the deep end alone all the time. Most of the time, yes. I have not been all over neither beach nor cliff, and my observations are stated solely on what part of beach I saw. As for the peeing, I don't belive that is a solely norwegian thing, what I wrote was based on the comments I got from locals. English is not my native tounge and sometimes it comes off different than I intended

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No need to apologize. You made it clear that it was your observation and nothing more. Some folks just like to nitpick. I appreciate your perspective and thank you for sharing your trip through your eyes.

Sometimes I feel like I am in English class with all the corrections made on here. Relax folks!!!!

When not in Negril, I like to stand neck-high in our bushes and pee in the deep end of our swimming pool. My wife is Irish and she's cool with it.

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Originally Posted by N5_

When not in Negril, I like to stand neck-high in our bushes and pee in the deep end of our swimming pool. My wife is Irish and she's cool with it.

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LOL! Your wife sounds chill like mine..... She's Irish as well.

Sometimes, with the ol' big bamboo, I like to stand in the deep end and pee in the bushes... ;)

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Originally Posted by brasi

"I know there are circumstances where people from very different socio-economic backgrounds and ages might just actually fall in love, but we all know that most of the time, the disadvantaged person is only in the relationship because they feel they have no other choice financially..."

Good insight. True in some cases.

But, I have seen just as many Jamaican men/women doing very well "playing the game"... meeting a guy/gal every other week ... promising love ... then asking for money ... he/she leaves the rock ... Guy/Gal #2 lands ... rinse, repeat ... 9 different men/women on speed dial ... a nice, comfy life based on making phone calls and walking the beach all day. The alternative would be getting a real job...right?

It isn't easy social situation to figure out. Thanks to my real Jamaican friends, and some cool boardies...I managed to get caught in that trap only once...and I'm not ashamed to admit it ... a lot of these "players" are GOOD ... they know every in/out/emotional ploy there is .... just about when you are asking yourself "This can't happen to me, I'm too savvy, right?" ... it probably is ... or why would you be asking/doubting it? LOL Do your friends at home ask you for money? Or call you 237 times in a day?

Someone said this here not long ago: "As long as the relationships are between consenting adults, it's no one's business."

Everything else, guessing at things, who did what and how people hooked up ... is plain and pure speculation ... and I agree. Everyone involved in any relationship between foreign and Ja needs to watch their heart ... and their wallet ... and as long as it's respectful, and no one is mistreated ... that's life ... it doesn't come with an instruction manual.

Just my $.02

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I've found that the easiest way to tell if someone is genuine is if they don't expect you to buy them anything and definitely don't ask for money or other stuff....simple. For guys traveling to JA that might work differently since you are kind of expected to buy the ladies a drink...but from a woman's standpoint how the hell does it look if a man expects you to buy the drinks, food, pay entrance fee's or whatever else...I can't speak for anyone else but I think something is definitely wrong with that picture and anyone that obliges and thinks it's Ok, well you already know what you are getting into.

:oI once peed in a pool over a bush:o

Thanks Sheba, we are only going to be there for a week, but I'm going to try and fit lots in. I am already researching other parts of the island for future, hopefully longer trips!

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Originally Posted by Sheba

Hope you and your Mum have a wonderful time in Jamaica.
Try to see more places than Negril.
There are many beautiful parts of Jamaica to be seen
Safe travels.

B

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Thanks, I know we will have a great time, I've never let what people think stop me before so I'm not going to start now :)

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Originally Posted by brasi

"I know there are circumstances where people from very different socio-economic backgrounds and ages might just actually fall in love, but we all know that most of the time, the disadvantaged person is only in the relationship because they feel they have no other choice financially..."

Good insight. True in some cases.

But, I have seen just as many Jamaican men/women doing very well "playing the game"... meeting a guy/gal every other week ... promising love ... then asking for money ... he/she leaves the rock ... Guy/Gal #2 lands ... rinse, repeat ... 9 different men/women on speed dial ... a nice, comfy life based on making phone calls and walking the beach all day. The alternative would be getting a real job...right?

It isn't easy social situation to figure out. Thanks to my real Jamaican friends, and some cool boardies...I managed to get caught in that trap only once...and I'm not ashamed to admit it ... a lot of these "players" are GOOD ... they know every in/out/emotional ploy there is .... just about when you are asking yourself "This can't happen to me, I'm too savvy, right?" ... it probably is ... or why would you be asking/doubting it? LOL Do your friends at home ask you for money? Or call you 237 times in a day?

Someone said this here not long ago: "As long as the relationships are between consenting adults, it's no one's business."

Everything else, guessing at things, who did what and how people hooked up ... is plain and pure speculation ... and I agree. Everyone involved in any relationship between foreign and Ja needs to watch their heart ... and their wallet ... and as long as it's respectful, and no one is mistreated ... that's life ... it doesn't come with an instruction manual.

Just my $.02

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Yeah, there are definitely players on both side. Back in the day I used to go to a lot of reggae parties/dances where the male contingent was largely off-shore farm workers 'fresh from yard', not all Jamaican but mostly. I've seen woman after woman used for getting landed immigrant status then dumped right after the guy gets his papers (or treated so badly they get rid of the guy.) Sometimes its SO obvious but no one can tell someone that when they're in "love".
And I've always seen the odd time where one of these guys actually does fall in love with a Canadian girl and they stay together, it definitely can happen. I guess I'm just uncomfortable with the idea of being viewed as someone with privilege taking advantage of someone. Oh well...I know I'm not and thats all that matters :)

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Originally Posted by utenlov

I think the thing that pissed us off the most was a lovely older man who wandered the beach with his guitar or uke, can't remember which, anyways this group of 6 or so adults spent 30 minutes, listening to him, requesting songs than not offering him a tip. That burned us so bad, we saw it from afar but it left a lasting impression on us, and i'm sure has helped us be better tippers and more aware of our actions. Funny you should bring that up, I saw this go down to.
As for the higglers I did what I always do, wait until the last couple of days to buy anything. I find that no matter where I am, if I don't buy anything or respond to them they leave me alone after a couple of days. And I notice that word gets around on who's buying. The only thing I bought throughout the entire stay was cigarettes. I know I could get them cheaper, but I'm more than happy to pay a buck or two extra to have them on the beach! Well, I did buy ganj the first day. Off course he tried to stress me out, give me pisspoor quality at a ridiculous price, but I wasn't having it. End of story, I got the good stuff and at a fair price. Fair in the sence that I know I overpaid, but again to be able to buy it off the beach like that I think of it as service charge. Also I'm familiar with the consept of tourist prices and local prices, and to be honest I do think that's somewhat fair.

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I am wondering if you do know that in fact, "ganja" is ILLEGAL in Jamaica. Also this board is NOT limited to adults only. When you post about it, you are promoting it- what does this say to younger visitors? Lastly, assuming you knew that is is illegal- why do you think you deserve a "fair price" on buying it? I would like to hear your logic on this.

IRIE! *IG

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Originally Posted by Jbizek

It's something that really stayed with me. They wasted his time, pretended to be friendly and than screwed him. And seeing people be asses to the staff made me try to be three times kinder and always quick with a smile and a big Thank You!
Funny about your Ganga story. I lucked out first go round, with quality stuff, in fact while reading a trip report on here I saw the name of the place mentioned and I pm'd the author asking if that vendor was still around, turns out I got the scoop and will be set this next go. My second time I got crap from a mans crotch...don't ask I still shudder thinking about it...lol. I know better now and that's what matters.

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Now THIS - REALLY blows my mind. You got advice about WHERE to buy your "ganja" on this board? Had no idea the PM was for that function...HEY if you folks want to smoke your freakin brains out and disrespect the laws of the country you "profess" to love so much, go for it- if your Mama didn't raise you better there isn't any changing your entitled attitude now-BUT PLEASE do NOT mention your sources here, or even allude to them. FOR ONE REASON- you dopers could be getting your "suppliers" in a LOT of trouble by "advertising" for them here, OR even in PM. You guys are really clueless if you think only people planning to take trips to Jamaica read this board...

*IG

Uten, Thanks for the read... I Always say Negril and tequila have the same effect on me.....I'm a Goddess and everyone wants me...LOL, Naw really I don't get hit on much, I was told once by our tax driver I looked like a piece of cake, made me LOL...

I have never really seen any tourists Gone wild or behave badly, but I will pay more attention...My first trip to Negril we stayed at a little all inclusive, and the only time I have ever seen anything that made me think "holy s#*%" was a woman stumbling down the beach at 4:00 am slurringg"help me" "hide me" she was being followed-there was a group of us playing poker...so the hotel security walked her to the front beach road and put her in a taxi, she was making her way to mi yard...she should have been headed to bed I thought.

I'm glad to hear you will be back, it really is a beautiful place, and I love the food, people, and music...

CDn~ Rule number 1 = always remember the saying "who cares"!!!
enjoy YOUR time enjour YOUR holiday have a great time and WHO CARES what anyone thinks?..they don't pay your bills, go enjoy yourself have a great time do all the things you always wanted to do and so should mum!

I originally wasn't going to write anything on the subject of ganja because it is a open board. When I saw that so many others speak freely on the topic I thought it wasn't going to be a problem. Apparently I managed yet again to step on some toes. My reasons for smoking is mine, and mine alone. As for the fair price, it's basically the same as with everything else. You pay what it is worth, plus tourist and beach "charge" The illegal part of it? Well, I guess that would be my problem? Like it or not, it is part of a culture. Some like that part, some don't. I don't smoke it on the beach, near kids or people who obviously don't like it. Promoting it? I think not, I should think that everyone in the world knows this goes on in Ja and if Ja is chosen for a destination I'd like to think that people know they'll encounter it. That is all I'm gonna share on that matter. As for sharing more on my observations and experiences down there, I'm not sure.

if your Mama didn't raise you better there isn't any changing your entitled attitude now Island girl, please refrain from making assumptions on how my mother raised me. You can critisize and question me, my actions and my opinion all you want. I chose to write on this board. But to blatantly say peoples mother did a poor job raising them is just rude. You know nothing of my mother, and I suspect you know nothing of other boardies mothers as well.

Well said Tic and utenlov! And I think Rob does a good job of monitoring the board himself.

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Originally Posted by N5_

When not in Negril, I like to stand neck-high in our bushes and pee in the deep end of our swimming pool. My wife is Irish and she's cool with it.

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LOL LOL
Nice report! Happy to know you will be back some day.

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Originally Posted by TiCtOc

CDn~ Rule number 1 = always remember the saying "who cares"!!!
enjoy YOUR time enjour YOUR holiday have a great time and WHO CARES what anyone thinks?..they don't pay your bills, go enjoy yourself have a great time do all the things you always wanted to do and so should mum!

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Thanks TiCtOc! I just finished reading your trip report, hope I have even a fraction of the fun you had, great read! :)

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Originally Posted by utenlov

I originally wasn't going to write anything on the subject of ganja because it is a open board. When I saw that so many others speak freely on the topic I thought it wasn't going to be a problem. Apparently I managed yet again to step on some toes. My reasons for smoking is mine, and mine alone. As for the fair price, it's basically the same as with everything else. You pay what it is worth, plus tourist and beach "charge" The illegal part of it? Well, I guess that would be my problem? Like it or not, it is part of a culture. Some like that part, some don't. I don't smoke it on the beach, near kids or people who obviously don't like it. Promoting it? I think not, I should think that everyone in the world knows this goes on in Ja and if Ja is chosen for a destination I'd like to think that people know they'll encounter it. That is all I'm gonna share on that matter. As for sharing more on my observations and experiences down there, I'm not sure.

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hear hear!

Utenlov -

For better and worse you jumped right into the cove of sensitive subjects. I read nothing that wasn't pretty clearly identified as YOUR opinion and got a pretty clear sense of an approach that seeks to AVOID stepping on peoples toes. Cross language miscommunication is always a problem but your English is excellent, clear and concise. I didn't see anything on this thread that would put any Jamaican or visitor at risk for being outed by even the most inquisitive and aggressive detective. I would certainly understand your reticence to post more but still hope you do. I find your writing and viewpoint intriguing.

Peace and Understanding...

My Dear Ms Utenlov.
As they say in Jamaica. ' Nuh feel nuh way'.
I appreciated reading your observations and applaud you on your command of the English language.
I have noticed that there are many different interpretations of the English language.
Thank you for your observations.
Maybe more people would not have misunderstood you if you had written in your Mother language . :eek:
One love.,
B

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Originally Posted by Maryann

Well said Tic and utenlov! And I think Rob does a good job of monitoring the board himself.

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I agree with this statement.
Could we have some feed back on this please.
No direspect intended. :)

Thanks
B

I just want to say that I enjoyed reading your observations very much, and realized fully that they were just that, your observations.

I also want to say that some people's holier than thou narrowminded attitudes are what has stopped me from doing a trip report on my last trip last November on this site. I am ACTIVIST about my being PRO cannabis, here and everywhere, and am very upfront and open about. It's ridiculous that something that is part of a RELIGION in Jamaica is illegal in the first place, and MY opinion is that it is ONLY still illegal because of people who don't know the FACTS about how beneficial it truly is, and that there is money to be made by keeping it illegal. That being said, of course I don't flaunt it and also don't smoke around others who don't, but yes, it IS and always will be a part of why I love Jamaica so much.

And yeah, I really expect this to be censored, but oh well, I'm still going to put it out there.

This thread has run its useful length and has been gradually turning into a name calling session. Ganja is ILLEGAL in Jamaica. Anyone silly enough to post on this board about doing illegal activities while in Jamaica deserves what happens to them. But under NO CIRCUMSTANCES should anyone ever mention other parties in their escapades. Those posts have been and will always be subject to removal.

And please remember folks, this board is open to everyone, and those that feel this information is important will use it as they see fit. It is not unusual to have the US Government DEA IP addresses to frequent this site.

This thread is closed.