This thread was my personal feelings after the death of a friend.
Nothing more.
This thread was my personal feelings after the death of a friend.
Nothing more.
Last edited by airswift; 12-08-2019 at 08:00 AM.
Yeah I hear you, thinking the same. This is happening too often - I posted a couple months ago about a murder in Sav close to me. I bought a house in Jamaica but can and will walk away if I start feeling too unsafe.
It's a big world. Problems everywhere. People say "Life is hard in Jamaica". True, but globally, Jamaica is around the middle in per-capita income at around 10K, while it is #1 or #2 in murder rate at 57 per 100,000. Compare for example Burundi with per-capita income just $732 but murder rate 1/10 that of Jamaica. True of most African countries. Then again, in Jamaica you won't get bit by a malarial mosquito or attacked by an angry hippo. Risks everywhere I guess. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...PP)_per_capita
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o..._homicide_rate
If I look elsewhere I will consider the whole world, not just the Caribbean. Belize I would reject (will be underwater soon). I hear New Zealand is nice ...
Last edited by rtitle; 12-04-2019 at 11:04 AM. Reason: add links
I'm not saying stay away, but if your only reasoning for going to another country is because of the violence in Jamaica, maybe you'd best check some facts and figures.Originally Posted by airswift
centralamerica.com/living/safety/crime-in-belize-how-safe-is-it/
142 murders in Belize last year and some reports on the web says Belize is one of the most violent countries in the world per capita, so your logic is not sound. I'm not saying Jamaica is safe, it's not, but short of the south pole, I can't think of anywhere in the world that is "safe". So, if you don't follow a high risk life style (drug dealer), don't flash money or expensive jewelry, don't smoke crack cocaine down a dark ally, Negril Jamaica is as safe as any where. In fact, IMHO Negril is quite a bit safer now than it was 10 years ago. The police, military and SOE have taken their toll on the criminal element. I'm seeing way more police on the beach and in the cliffs. The ATV patrol is great to see. Personally, I don't feel unsafe in Negril.
This just happened in Belize two days ago. https://edition.channel5belize.com/archives/194945
Browns, your logic is not sound. I posted earlier the murder rate statistics from Wikipedia. At 57 per 100,000, Jamaica shares with a few Central American countries the honor of being the most murderous country in the world, 10x to 100x higher than most places in the world. Belize is up there too, so it's not a good comparison point, but you could throw a dart at Africa or Asia to pick a safer country than Jamaica. The thing that disturbs me about this latest murder is that the victims, as far as we know, were not drug dealers flashing big money and expensive jewelry. Instead it looks like a house robbery. Like you, I used to feel safe in Jamaica. Not so much now.
Belize is not safe unless you live behind a gated community or on an island.
So, my wife and I aren't really "adventurers" so to speak. When we go to JA we use trusted drivers, travel during the day when possible, avoid the hot spots, all the usual travel security, and it would be no different than if we were going to Miami. Watch yourself, use people you trust and keep your eyes open. Mostly we are on or around the beach. In a post I wrote sometime ago about the changing "vibe" in Jamaica I couldn't completely put my finger on it. The bigger hotels, the money, increasing costs and the edge on the salesmen all seem to be symptoms to me now. In the gradual change in prosperity of the island and the influx of media showing what life could be like, I think we are witnessing the usual paradigm shift you might see in any country edging closer to a second or first world country. The gap, not unlike first world countries, between the upper and lower classes may be widening. Dare I say a new middle class may be taking a hold in Jamaica. The have not's with the means and numbers may be resentful that their status isn't changing as fast as they feel it should, and they may be taking matters into their own hands. The social economic period they are going through has happened in many other countries, it's not unlike the old west was in the united states. This might be the new edge I have felt from the salesman as the laid back pitch has more urgency to it than I used to see. In my humble opinion the crimes of passion and crimes of opportunity don't surprise me in this type of environment. What surprises me about this crime is that at first glance it appears to be premeditated, as if they were chosen as a mark. This appears to me to be outside of the obvious gang and drug premeditated crime. My wife and I are pretty much fly by the seat of our pants travelers and I'm sure we could go to Jamaica many more times and be unnoticed by the locals. Having said that, moving to Jamaica in retirement and trying to start a small venture to subsidize retirement seems more and more like a far off dream as that may get us noticed. Of course this entire post is just my feelings about the situation and maybe I'm off the mark, but I usually trust my feelings.
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Good luck finding a destination without crime. I live in the country near a little town (4,000, maybe) in Southwest Michigan and we had cops all over our area this morning chasing a fleeing unsub. Crime happens everywhere, not just in Negril.
I have to agree with most of Irene's points. I also think that many of us have made good friends and good contacts in Jamaica and the news of violence involving any of our friends hits a little closer to home.
I don't consider myself an adventurer. I have a belief that people are mostly good and you can go most places, even very poor places, and people will treat you well if you treat them well. I don't travel around with a driver or with "security". We're all human beings sharing a planet. I travel to make connections with my fellow human beings (regardless of whether those fellow human beings are rich or poor, black or white, or whatever). I like this video by a young American couple who went to Haiti with an attitude to travel similar to mine. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41xaVQ7KOJ8&t=644s
I don't really know why Jamaica's crime rate is so high, but I still feel like *most* people are nice and I'm still going to trust that I'll be fine if I treat people well and am friends with the good people. If I start feeling unsafe I will leave. I will not live behind big security walls with security guards.
You might be on the right track, Irine. My guess is the disproportionately high crime rate has to do with the juxtaposition of rich tourists vacationing in luxury, right alongside the poor rural communities. That, together with the history of being a brutal slave colony, probably leads to resentment, and may account for the high crime rate. Higher for example than in neighboring Haiti which is much poorer but does not have the huge tourist business that Jamaica has. Just a guess. I'm not a sociologist. There is a new book by an actual Harvard sociologist Orlando Patterson (who is Jamaican) which I have not yet read, but it appears to explore these issues based on the book reviews. https://www.amazon.com/Confounding-I...5489533&sr=8-1
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